Hi everyone,

This is my first post to the Bible Memory list.  I'm a licensed marriage and
family therapist (in California) who's been leading small groups within the
Christian community for several years. I've been memorizing passages of
Scripture (with varying degrees of commitment) for over twenty years.  My
history with memorization/meditation goes back to Bill Gothard and his section
of the red notebook (Basic Youth Conflicts) that highlights the importance of
Scripture memorization/meditation and makes the promise of great success to
anyone who will memorize/meditate (his recommendation is about 20
verses/week--give me a break, I've never been in that stratosphere for long,
though I am sure he's right about the blessing).

Here is one of my strategies which has been a huge help for me. It is designed
to work with passages of five or more verses but can be used, I suppose, for
verse memory.

Anyway, the method is to record the first letter of each word on index cards
which allows for review and word perfect memory. It also is a great motivational
aide (sure beats just repeating the text over and over!). Just because I can, I
usually also have a card with the text
completely spelled out.   The cards end up looking like this:

****************************
1 Cor. 5:1-10
IiarttisiayaoaktdnoeapAmhhfw2AyapSyrhbfwgahpooyftmwdt3EtIanppIawyisAIhap
jotowdtjaiIwp4WyaaitnooLJaIawyisatpooLJip5htmotSsttsnmbdahssotdotL
6 YbingDyktalywttwbod 7 Grotoytymbanbwyayra
FCoPlhbs8TluktFnwtoytyomawbwbwytbosat
9Ihwyimlntawsip   10 naamtpotwwaiotgasoiItcywhtltw

1 Cor. 5:1-10
It is actually reported that there is sexual immorality among you, and of a kind
that does not occur even among pagans: A man has his father's wife. [2] And you
are proud! Shouldn't you rather have been filled with grief and have put out of
your fellowship the man who did this? [3] Even though I am not physically
present, I am with you in spirit. And I have already passed judgment on the one
who did this, just as if I were present. [4] When you are assembled in the name
of our Lord Jesus and I am with you in spirit, and the power of our Lord Jesus
is present, [5] hand this man over to Satan, so that the sinful nature may be
destroyed and his spirit saved on the day of the Lord. [6] Your boasting is not
good. Don't you know that a little yeast works through the whole batch of dough?
[7] Get rid of the old yeast that you may be a new batch without yeast--as you
really are. For Christ, our Passover lamb, has been sacrificed. [8] Therefore
let us keep the Festival, not with the old yeast, the yeast of malice and
wickedness, but with bread without yeast, the bread of sincerity and truth. [9]
I have written you in my letter not to associate with sexually immoral people--
[10] not at all meaning the people of this world who are immoral, or the greedy
and swindlers, or idolaters. In that case you would have to leave this world.
*****************************
I used to create these cards with a typewriter but, of course, now I cut and
paste the text from WordSearch and use a macro in MS Word to "minimize" them.  I
actually bought a printer with the specific requirement in mind that it could
print on 4x6 cards. This is a simple strategy that should complement other
techniques for enhancing memorization and meditation.

One more thing (if you're still with me)--I am currently in the midst of reading
"Daws", a biography of Dawson Trotman which constantly hammers away at the
importance of memorization.  I heartily recommend it.

Anyway, I hope this is helpful . . . God bless.

Michael Beavers, MS LMFT
Consultant--Children's System of Care/Wraparound

I have been having much difficulty memorizing
scriptures. In the past, it was easy for me to
memorize a chapter a week sometimes even in a few
days, but lately, I can't even get one verse to stick
for any length of time. What's wrong with me?

N. Wright


Psalm 62:11,12

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Greetings - send holiday greetings for Easter, Passover
http://greetings.yahoo.com/

Michael Beavers

thanks for sharing your tips about
what helps you in memorizing verses. I have taken a
stash of cards and have written them down just like
you said first letter of every word. This is the
greatest technique I've ever used. It is so helpful.

Thanks again

noel


__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Tax Center - online filing with TurboTax http://taxes.yahoo.com/

Earlier in the year, I invited people on this list to download InVerse = ver.
3.0.xx.  Since that time, I have incorporated numerous enhancements = (thanks
for the feedback!) and have released InVerse ver 3.2.05.  This = can be
considered a major upgrade to the previous version, and is = available for no
cost at www.bibleinverse.org or = http://groups.yahoo.com/group/InVerse/files

Enhancements include:
- Comes preloaded with 326 passages with extensive context (2200+ =
verses)
- Context sensitive HtmlHelp built into application
- Passage topic and translation shown (NASB, NIV, NKJV, KJV, etc.)
- AddPassage and EditPassage imminent!  (anticipated for next release = later
this month)

For His glory and honor,
Lynn Allan

Noel,

probably lack of clarity in your mind.  we all have this problem from time to
time. sometimes i just go back and review verses i have memorized in the past...
new verses can wait till i get more clarity

-----Original Message-----
From: Noel [mailto:psalm64_10yahoo.com]
Sent: Tuesday, April 02, 2002 3:21 PM
To: biblememmemoryverses.org
Subject: Re: Scripture Memorization


I have been having much difficulty memorizing
scriptures. In the past, it was easy for me to
memorize a chapter a week sometimes even in a few
days, but lately, I can't even get one verse to stick
for any length of time. What's wrong with me?

N. Wright


Psalm 62:11,12

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Greetings - send holiday greetings for Easter, Passover
http://greetings.yahoo.com/

Brian-

There is an important part of the equation missing from your message: why do you
want to memorize scripture? If it is to keep the Word in your heart, or to fight
off the devil with "the sword of the Spirit which is the Word of God", then it
doesn't matter that all the verses come from the same translation. If you plan
to enter a contest, use whatever version they require by the rules of the
contest. If you want to reach out to others, use the translation that you feel
will bear fruit in the hearts of the lost. And finally, would it be so awful
that you should end up memorizing the same verse in more than one translation?

In Him,
Frank

-----Original Message-----
From: Brian Janko
To: biblememmemoryverses.org
Sent: 4/3/02 12:09 AM
Subject: Re: Scripture Memorization

Dear List,

I have a very difficult issue.  I have so much trouble deciding on which version
to meomrize.  Realizing that this could be a venture of many years, I of course
want a translataion with staying power.

I have formerly reae extensively from NIV.  I have heard the ESV is excellent
and more literal, but readable.... but who knows whether it has "staying power."

Of course, the most "proven" in terms of longevitiy is the hard-to-read, but
quite beautiful  KJV.

I guess I'm in the middle of a translation change.  I was i fine while I was
only reading, just sticking with the NIV.  (There's the debate now about who
owns that company and how long the NIV will be along and the TNIV,
gender-inclusiveness somethign I would like to avoid.)

When I became interested in more serious study and memorization I wanted
something more literal.  The NASB seems to be the winner here, but I stlll have
translational problem with here and there and realize that it's literalness does
not always provide accuracy of thought.

So, it's I mostly waver between the NASB, the KJV, and possibly the ESV.

Anyone have thought suggestions, advice guidelines help or antyghing else along
those lines?

Sincerely in Christ,
Brian Janko
brianjankonet.com

I've been on this list for quite a while, but seldom write.  I am one of the
slowest memorizers there is, but I have decided to memorize all the book of
Revelation, and am now on Chapter 5.  What I am using is a program I purchased
from Laridian called Memorize! which I put on my Palm Pilot. That in addition to
the 2 versions of the Bible that I also put on it have helped me tremendously!

I wish I could do better memorizing, but having done that much in less than a
year is good for me.  I just thank God I can read and remember.  :)

Once in school one of the classmates complained that they could not memorize
data.  When they were asked about current events they knew everything that was
happening.  So memorization is basically familiarization.

Take a sentence (not a whole verse) or a line and try remembering it.  Choose a
line a day.  After 5 days you will have a verse "memorized."

It could be that your time is not your own.  By that I mean that perhaps family
members encroach on your time (children, wife, husband, mother in law,
etc.) and you are trying to memorize in brief snatches.  Try to take more time
in solitude, reading over and over (repeatedly) the verse you want to memorize.
Use a tape recorder if you need to listen to yourself to see where you falter.
Try doing this the Muslim way (they pray 5 times a day) by doing it often
throughout the day.

It gets harder as more responsibilities encroach and as we get older it becomes
more difficult.  Another reason may be that you have lost your reason to
memorize.  Why do you memorize?  And how does memorization help you? Once you
establish your priority it may be easier.

Also, how is your nutrition?  Do you eat balanced meals and take vitamins? The
body responds to good nutrition (and that includes our brains).

Hope this helps.

Jack Wahlberg

Dear List,

I have a very difficult issue.  I have so much trouble deciding on which version
to meomrize.  Realizing that this could be a venture of many years, I of course
want a translataion with staying power.

I have formerly reae extensively from NIV.  I have heard the ESV is excellent
and more literal, but readable.... but who knows whether it has "staying power."

Of course, the most "proven" in terms of longevitiy is the hard-to-read, but
quite beautiful  KJV.

I guess I'm in the middle of a translation change.  I was i fine while I was
only reading, just sticking with the NIV.  (There's the debate now about who
owns that company and how long the NIV will be along and the TNIV,
gender-inclusiveness somethign I would like to avoid.)

When I became interested in more serious study and memorization I wanted
something more literal.  The NASB seems to be the winner here, but I stlll have
translational problem with here and there and realize that it's literalness does
not always provide accuracy of thought.

So, it's I mostly waver between the NASB, the KJV, and possibly the ESV.

Anyone have thought suggestions, advice guidelines help or antyghing else along
those lines?

Sincerely in Christ,
Brian Janko
brianjankonet.com

Thanks, for the technique of writing the first letter of each word on a card.  I
must admit I didn't think it would work but it great.

Wanda

-----Original Message-----
From:   LeeTidler [mailto:LeeTidlermsn.com]
Sent:   Tuesday, April 02, 2002 10:10 PM
To: biblememmemoryverses.org
Subject:    Re: Scripture Memorization

I've been on this list for quite a while, but seldom write.  I am one of the
slowest memorizers there is, but I have decided to memorize all the book of
Revelation, and am now on Chapter 5.  What I am using is a program I purchased
from Laridian called Memorize! which I put on my Palm Pilot. That in addition to
the 2 versions of the Bible that I also put on it have helped me tremendously!

I wish I could do better memorizing, but having done that much in less than a
year is good for me.  I just thank God I can read and remember.  :)

You're most welcome.  It's just a tool, but it's a nice one.  In college I
remember we used to laminate them so them were more durable (some would use them
in the shower!) but now I do them on computer so they're practically disposable.

MB

_________________________________________________________________
Join the world’s largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail. http://www.hotmail.com



>From: Noel 
>Reply-To: biblememmemoryverses.org
>To: biblememmemoryverses.org
>Subject: Re: Scripture Memorization
>Date: Wed, 03 Apr 2002 21:59:08 -0500
>
>Michael Beavers
>
>thanks for sharing your tips about
>what helps you in memorizing verses. I have taken a
>stash of cards and have written them down just like
>you said first letter of every word. This is the
>greatest technique I've ever used. It is so helpful.
>
>Thanks again
>
>noel
>
>
>__________________________________________________
>Do You Yahoo!?
>Yahoo! Tax Center - online filing with TurboTax http://taxes.yahoo.com/
>
>
>
>
>

To:  Brian Janko

Greetings,

I really like memorizing the NASB.  After several years, I am now trying to
"update" to the NASB 1995 Update and it is very difficult.

Even though I think the NASB is the most accurate, I would suggest you stick
with the version you have memorized the most.  It is very difficult to change.

In Christ

Lee Delbridge
LDelbridgemsn.com



----- Original Message -----

From: Brian Janko
Sent: Wednesday, April 03, 2002 2:07 AM
To: biblememmemoryverses.org
Subject: Re: Scripture Memorization

Dear List,

I have a very difficult issue.  I have so much trouble deciding on which version
to meomrize.  Realizing that this could be a venture of many years, I of course
want a translataion with staying power.

I have formerly reae extensively from NIV.  I have heard the ESV is excellent
and more literal, but readable.... but who knows whether it has "staying power."

Of course, the most "proven" in terms of longevitiy is the hard-to-read, but
quite beautiful  KJV.

I guess I'm in the middle of a translation change.  I was i fine while I was
only reading, just sticking with the NIV.  (There's the debate now about who
owns that company and how long the NIV will be along and the TNIV,
gender-inclusiveness somethign I would like to avoid.)

When I became interested in more serious study and memorization I wanted
something more literal.  The NASB seems to be the winner here, but I stll= l
have translational problem with here and there and realize that it's literalness
does not always provide accuracy of thought.

So, it's I mostly waver between the NASB, the KJV, and possibly the ESV.

Anyone have thought suggestions, advice guidelines help or antyghing else along
those lines?

Sincerely in Christ,
Brian Janko
brianjankonet.com

Hello!  My name is Ruth and I am a wife and mother of 4 (5 yrs-5 months).  I
know memorization of the Bible is very important and the version of the Bible I
read, memorize is the KJV.

Recently I have been reading "The Memory Book" and haven't finished it yet.  It
has some great memory systems in it.

I am now wondering, how one could use them to memorize scripture.  The phoentic
alphabet will help with chapter and verse location...but can you use these
systems for the actual verses, chapters, book memorization.

Any thoughts would be great!

Ruth

Ruthie_2webtv.net

Ruth,

I've given some thoughts to using mnemonics for Scripture memory. Beyond using
the phonetic number alphabet for numbers, memorizing the actual text of the
Scriptures becomes complicated.

Jerry Lucas wrote another book, (c) 1978,  _Ready, Set, Remember_ from Memory
Press, primarily for children, to help form chains of (funny) pictures to
memorize a wide variety of information... And I'm glad I looked into the book,
because I THOUGHT this was the one about Scripture memory and it's not.  ...
Sorry, I don't even have the title of the book I was thinking about that
suggested images for linking together Bible outlines... After buying it and
looking through it, I decided that I would have had difficulty using that method
myself.

Most mnemonic systems (e.g., _The Memory Book_) encourage students to memorize a
standard mental chain, most often actually NUMBERS (typically 1-100), and
encourage practice in linking items in memory with the images associated with
the numbers.

Harry Lorrayne later published a tape-series that was supposed to be different,
but he still encouraged students to construct mental chains (assigned by him) or
structures, such as the physical layout of one's home in childhood, in which to
"put" things and/or "link" things to be remembered. Unfortunately, I was never
able to forge the images and associations quickly enough to be useful in the
"field", and I never succeeded in employing this effectively for remembering
Scripture.

Actually, I was first exposed to the concepts of mnemonics in my late teens,
soon after I had trusted Christ, and my initial fascination with Bruno Furst's
concepts in _Ready, Set, Remember_ verged over into an attitude that I decided
was not spiritually healthy FOR ME. But I also went through similar
"infatuation" phases with computers & telecommunications (in BBS days) and with
Esperanto, the International Language. I think that all these things can be good
TOOLS, and we humans tend to become infatuated with our tools. Once they're in
the right place in our heart, I believe that they can be used PROPERLY in
service for the Kingdom.

I have no objection to employing pre-existing "chains" of association on which
to link topics... or simply employing verse-numbers linking to keywords or main
concepts in a verse. I just haven't done this well. I think that if a child
could learn these basic concepts of mnemonics (especially the number images
1-100) very early on... like maybe while in the process of learning the numbers
themselves, that using association-links would seem much less artificial. I've
heard hints that SOME homeschoolers employ mnemonics for general studies, but
haven't heard much about using this with Scripture memory.


Frankly, I've never succeeded in using "funny pictures" to string together the
themes of Scripture. I have made a practice of skim-reading, or really,
page-flipping, through my marked-up study Bible, counting through the chapters
and trying to catalog/review the topics of the paragraphs/ sections in each
chapter. I'm sure that the Irving Jensen style Inductive Bible study procedures
(generally also used by InterVarsity Christian Fellowship) which have students
prepare paragraph charts for the book being studied, would work even better for
theme review. The "initials" technique with a coach would be good for getting
the word-for-word contents tightened up. It sounds funny to say it this way, but
I think people (at least myself!) need to be reminded that memorizing the WORDS
of Scripture is not quite the same thing as STUDYING the Scriptures,
understanding their contents, and applying them to our lives.

Henrietta Mears in _What the Bible is All About_ employs lots of "cute" things
to help illustrate and string together the ideas and contents of the texts being
considered, and --although it doesn't LOOK "scholarly", WTBIAA actually serves
as a pretty good Bible survey textbook. The more you study the Bible in context,
and THINK about the "flow" of thought and action in the text, the better you'll
be able to remember it.

Concerning Jerry Lucas' techniques of associating funny pictures with the
outline-contents of Scripture, I heard some folks object to using "funny" stuff
to help remember God's holy Word (and I admit that I had some of those thoughts
myself). However, I'm not so sure that this is any worse than what other folks
have done with Holy Writ... And I think it's much more a matter of the heart of
the individual Bible student.

I don't think that there's any "magic" technique for memorizing Scripture. It
helps a LOT if you started memorizing literature (including Scripture) in
childhood. I'm glad that my parents put me into a program in which I was
required to memorize and recite poetry, and later encouraged me in drama/acting,
in which I had to memorize my scripts QUICKLY. Lots of Muslims scattered all
around the world, beginning in childhood, memorize the entire Koran _in_Arabic_,
which is close in length to the New Testament. However, typically, they are
taught to emphasize memorizing the WORDS correctly, and we would want to
emphasize understanding the MEANING and APPLICATIONS of the Scripture, as well
as the words themselves. We also have the major difference that Protestant
Christians usually use translations rather than encouraging EVERYBODY to learn
Hebrew and Greek, and NO _translation_ can truly claim to be inspired by God.

Over 20 years ago, when I was in college & beginning seminary, I heard the
report that one young man in our college department had memorized the entire New
American Standard Bible New Testament, but he didn't want his identity to be
known. My "prime suspect" evaded some of my direct questions, married a sweet
young lady, and took a job as an engineer. One does NOT have to BE a preacher or
BECOME a preacher to memorize and meditate on the Scriptures. The promises in
Psalm 1, Joshua 1 and James 1 are that those who MEDITATE on Scripture will be
successful in whatever they do... and there are lots of things to do in the
"real world" that do NOT involve "becoming a 'minister'"...

...Sorry,... I slipped over onto my soap-box...

Let us know whatever more you find out about mnemonics, and how you're able to
employ it in Scripture memorization. I'm still thinking about this stuff, and am
still committed to being a "lifetime learner", even now that I'm officially
"pushing 50"... (I'll turn 49 in June).

It has been several years since I've reviewed the _Institute in Basic Life
Principles_ (formerly, "Institute in Basic Youth Conflicts"), taught by Bill
Gothard. I thought that his suggestions and guidelines for memorizing and
meditating on Scripture were very valuable. Can anybody on the list post some
more recent reports about Gothard's ministry?

God bless!

--Clyde

Ruth wrote:
>
> Hello!  My name is Ruth and I am a wife and mother of 4 (5 yrs-5
> months).  I know memorization of the Bible is very important and the
> version of the Bible I read, memorize is the KJV.
>
> Recently I have been reading "The Memory Book" and haven't finished it
> yet.  It has some great memory systems in it.
>
> I am now wondering, how one could use them to memorize scripture.  The
> phoentic alphabet will help with chapter and verse location...but can
> you use these systems for the actual verses, chapters, book
> memorization.
>
> Any thoughts would be great!
>
> Ruth
>
> Ruthie_2webtv.net

--
Clyde C. PRICE, Jr.   h-678-393-1782, m-678-491-0469
reply to: 
Founder & President, the Christian Digital Library Foundation 
To learn more write . CDLF is looking for Scribes, Eager
Readers, and other friends to enjoy, distribute, and produce digital Christian
books and other resources to build up the Body of Christ. Vice President,
Parakletos Ministries Inc. PM seeks to support the ministries of local churches
in building evangelizing Kingdom-seeking disciples. Box 214, Suite 205 11770
Haynes Bridge Rd. Alpharetta, GA 30004 USA

>I've given some thoughts to using mnemonics for Scripture memory ...

Clyde, appreciate your sharing all those thoughts!

I, too, really appreciated what was given at the Basic Institute in Life
Principles (Bill Gothard) on Scripture memorization and meditation. (Actually,
I've told many people that I think that one week seminar is worth a year in
Bible college!) We attended several times and found many very Biblical
principles presented very practically - in addition to this area. Having been
working in Indonesia for some years, we haven't had a chance to attend one of
those seminars recently, so I'd also be interested in hearing what some others
have found recently at these, especially in this area of memorization and
meditation.

Yours in Christ,

Roger Doriot
UFM International

PS. If any of you are looking for things to pray for, pray for my students as I
put a lot of emphasis on Scripture memorization in my classes here at Washington
Bible College near DC, where I'm teaching a few hours during furlough. Some of
them think it is kind of heavy! :)

Hi all,

My name is Bob Phillips. This note is in reference to scripture memorization. I
had a conversation with one of our members who, for example, had memorized the
entire book of Mark, and got up one evening at service and recited one of the
chapters.

I then asked him after the service how he had done this.  He said that he had
done this based on the concept of the Shema (Deut. 6:4-9):

4 Hear, O Israel: The LORD our God is one LORD: 5 And thou shalt love the LORD
thy God with all thine heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy might. 6
And these words, which I command thee this day, shall be in thine heart: 7 And
thou shalt teach them diligently unto thy children, and shalt talk of them when
thou sittest in thine house, and when thou walkest by the way, and when thou
liest down, and when thou risest up. 8 And thou shalt bind them for a sign upon
thine hand, and they shall be as frontlets between thine eyes. 9 And thou shalt
write them upon the posts of thy house, and on thy gates.

It seemed to work pretty well for him.

Blessings all,

Bob

Ruth,

If you're interested, I found this book by Jerry Lucas listed on Amazon.com.
However, it seems to be more oriented to memorizing Bible facts -- the 12
apostles, the parables, the Books of the Bible, the Ten Commandments, the Fruit
of the Spirit, Gifts of the Spirit, etc. -- rather than actual verses. However,
I did not look it over very thoroughly so I could be wrong about that.

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/1930853068/qid=1018913749/sr=1-5/ref
=
sr_1_5/102-2548696-0676168

Brian Janko
brianjankonet.com

To Linda and Brian,

Choosing an English translation is NOT an easy task, and in the current "market"
in which the translations we've BEEN using and the very new ones that we would
CONSIDER using are all likely to go through significant edition-changes before
long. I agree with Linda that "upgrading" from NASB77 to NASB95 is a hassle, but
I had gotten rusty on my bulk-memory anyway, so "upgrading" may not be much more
work than simply _reviewing_ would have been, for me. I really NEED a "coach".

To Brian: After spending only minutes in ESV, I considered that the passages I
looked at quickly were at least as awkward as the general style in NASB. The
older RSV is still being published by a very few publishers. I haven't yet had
the opportunity to review the new TNIV, and have heard mixed reports about this
version: The negative statements I've seen seem to be rooted in objections to
the policy itself of making general statements gender-neutral (as was the stated
policy of NRSV). Of course, objections to this policy have to be evaluated on a
case-by-case basis, and I have already found in NRSV places which were
"neutralized" which should not have been, and I often didn't like the way they
handled it even in cases which I did consider legitimate. I've enjoyed reading
in the LBT, but haven't read enough to give a real "review". I'm not really
satisfied with any of the older English versions with which I'm familiar, mostly
because of idiosyncrasies of one-person versions and/or archaic language.

>From a very personal standpoint, I don't like about half the changes
from NASB77 to NASB95. Neither edition is "perfect", but then NO English
translation (or any other translation) is PERFECT. For MY OWN memorization, I've
decided to stay with NASB95, but I don't recommend this strongly to others. I
WISH that I had a better recommendation. I'm watching this discussion, and the
issue in general, with great interest.

--Clyde

Linda Delbridge wrote:
>
> To:  Brian Janko
>
> Greetings,
>
> I really like memorizing the NASB.  After several years, I am now
> trying to "update" to the NASB 1995 Update and it is very difficult.
>
> Even though I think the NASB is the most accurate, I would suggest you
> stick with the version you have memorized the most.  It is very
> difficult to change.
>
> In Christ
>
> Lee Delbridge
> LDelbridgemsn.com
>
> ----- Original Message -----
>
> From: Brian Janko
> Sent: Wednesday, April 03, 2002 2:07 AM
> To: biblememmemoryverses.org
> Subject: Re: Scripture Memorization
>
> Dear List,
>
> I have a very difficult issue.  I have so much trouble deciding on
> which version to meomrize.  Realizing that this could be a venture of
> many
years,
> I of course want a translataion with staying power.
>
> I have formerly reae extensively from NIV.  I have heard the ESV is
> excellent and more literal, but readable.... but who knows whether it
> has "staying power."
>
> Of course, the most "proven" in terms of longevitiy is the
> hard-to-read, but quite beautiful  KJV.
>
> I guess I'm in the middle of a translation change.  I was i fine while
> I was only reading, just sticking with the NIV.  (There's the debate
> now about who owns that company and how long the NIV will be along and
> the TNIV, gender-inclusiveness somethign I would like to avoid.)
>
> When I became interested in more serious study and memorization I
> wanted something more literal.  The NASB seems to be the winner here,
> but I
stll=
> l have translational problem with here and there and realize that it's
> literalness does not always provide accuracy of thought.
>
> So, it's I mostly waver between the NASB, the KJV, and possibly the
> ESV.
>
> Anyone have thought suggestions, advice guidelines help or antyghing
> else along those lines?
>
> Sincerely in Christ,
> Brian Janko
> brianjankonet.com

--
Clyde C. PRICE, Jr.   h-678-393-1782, m-678-491-0469
reply to: 
Founder & President, the Christian Digital Library Foundation 
To learn more write . CDLF is looking for Scribes, Eager
Readers, and other friends to enjoy, distribute, and produce digital Christian
books and other resources to build up the Body of Christ. Vice President,
Parakletos Ministries Inc. PM seeks to support the ministries of local churches
in building evangelizing Kingdom-seeking disciples. Box 214, Suite 205 11770
Haynes Bridge Rd. Alpharetta, GA 30004 USA

> Recently I have been reading "The Memory Book" and haven't finished it
> yet.  It has some great memory systems in it.


Hi Ruth,

could you tell me more about "The Memory Book" ?

I have been searching for mnemo/memory-techniques lately for memorizing
bible-verses.

But I had not very much response from people using mnemo-techniques in bible
memorizing.

So I would be very interested

In HIS grace

<><

dino



Hi Clyde,

your mail caught my interest.
I want to answer to it "verse-topic by verse"

> I've given some thoughts to using mnemonics for Scripture memory.
Me too
> Beyond using the phonetic number alphabet for numbers,

what does that mean?
I am German and therefore am forced to ask for more understanding, sometimes.

> Jerry Lucas wrote another book, (c) 1978

would you advise this book?


> Most mnemonic systems (e.g., _The Memory Book_) encourage students to
> memorize a standard mental chain, most often actually NUMBERS
> (typically 1-100), and encourage practice in linking items in memory
> with the images associated with the numbers.

Could you give me an outline where to get info's about these mnemonic systems?

> Harry Lorrayne later published a tape-series that was supposed to be
> different,
where would it be available?

>Unfortunately, I was never able to forge the images and  associations
>quickly enough to be useful in the "field", and I never  succeeded in
>employing this effectively for remembering Scripture.

I used once a chain of  body-feelings like folding hands or forming a cup and
thus remembering. In the beginning I did these things really, afterwards, to
recall for memorizing, I had only to think of these movements to recall the
verses.

> Actually, I was first exposed to the concepts of mnemonics in my late
> teens, soon after I had trusted Christ, and my initial fascination
> with Bruno Furst's concepts in _Ready, Set, Remember_ verged over into
> an attitude that I decided was not spiritually healthy FOR ME.

where could I get Bruno  Furst's?

When I searched the net for mnemo-tech's and books, i sometime got the feeling
that the purpose of some authors was esoteric influenced. therefore I wanted to
wait till I could share with believers. On the other hand. In the days before
book-printing memorizing was mandatory for students and for speakers to memorize
all they wanted to learn or talk about or when holding a speech. I wanted to
trace these old techniques which have been used for instance in Greek and Roman
days.

> Frankly, I've never succeeded in using "funny pictures" to string
> together the themes of Scripture.

Every-one uses one sense more often, like right-handed ones
use mostly the right hands.
As kid I used to train my left hand to do what usually I did with my right hand.
As the right hand is steered to 70% by the left part of the brain, I thought
trainig my left hand would train myself to be able to use better my right
brain-hemisphere.

> have made a practice of
> skim-reading, or really, page-flipping,
what does that mean?

>'m sure that the Irving Jensen style Inductive Bible study procedures
(generally also
> used by InterVarsity Christian Fellowship)

How does that work and where can I get info about it?

> that memorizing the WORDS of Scripture is not quite the same thing as
> STUDYING the Scriptures, understanding their contents, and applying
> them to our lives.
Right , but it goes hand in hand
> Henrietta Mears in _What the Bible is All About_ employs lots of
> "cute" things to help illustrate and string together the ideas and
> contents of the texts being considered, and --although it doesn't LOOK
> "scholarly", WTBIAA actually serves as a pretty good Bible survey
> textbook.

where can I get more info about it?

The more
> you study the Bible in context, and THINK about the "flow" of thought
> and action in the text, the better you'll be able to remember it.

exactly

> typically, they are
> taught to emphasize memorizing the WORDS correctly, and we would want
> to emphasize understanding the MEANING and APPLICATIONS of the
> Scripture, as well as the words themselves. We also have the major
> difference that Protestant Christians usually use translations rather
> than encouraging EVERYBODY to learn Hebrew and Greek, and NO
> _translation_ can truly claim to be inspired by God.

Here in Germany when you want to become a muslim you should learn the coran by
heart,and the " pupils"  have to do it, even not knowing what it means because
they don't learn arabic. It is not wanted that they know what they learn.

But learning Greek and Hebrew  at my age? 58!
I doubt that I would be able to gather the sense.

for instance how could I find out what the hebrew word for rib really means?

I know three meanings :
1. rib  2. side  3. cell
for me it's the first adopted gene-technology, just to show us nowadays: for
me,GOD the almighty, this was nothing cmpared to how long you needed only to
think about it, and you are able to do it only because I created you.

> It has been several years since I've reviewed the _Institute in Basic
> Life Principles_ (formerly, "Institute in Basic Youth Conflicts"),
> taught by Bill Gothard. I thought that his suggestions and guidelines
> for memorizing and meditating on Scripture were very valuable. Can
> anybody on the list post some more recent reports about Gothard's
> ministry?

Could you tell me where to get info about this?

Thank you for listening and I thank you for bothering to provide me with info's.

Yours

in HIS Grace

<><
Dino

Good stuff Henry,

Gothard's ministry is still exploding. I see a lot of it going to homeschool
conventions. A significant # of them go through his training in high school and
government officials are really being touched by a branch they have.

Additionally, nearly 80,000 home schoolers use my mnemonic based MEMLOK Bible
Memory System, for which I am eternally thankful. I just posted a new free DEMO
at http://www.memlok.com/

At 4/15/02 03:58 PM, you wrote:
>'ve heard hints that
>SOME homeschoolers employ mnemonics for general studies, but haven't
>heard much about using this with Scripture memory.

Drake & Gina Mariani 800-373-1947 420 Montwood La Habra CA 90631
* MEMLOK The "Word Picture" Bible Memory System
* http://www.memlok.com    Email: mailto:memlokmemlok.com
* FREE Scripture Memory Cards
* http://www.memlok.com/free-scripture-memory-cards.html
* FREE Juice Plus Kids 6-15 http://www.memlok.com/jpcass.html
* Christians Pay Your Meds http://www.memlok.com/samaritan.html

Roger,

It's good to "meet" another IBLP alumnus. The impact on my life of the Basic
seminar was certainly greater on my day-to-day life than any year of my seminary
experience (except that in my first year at Atlanta School of Biblical Studies
--now American University of Biblical
Studies-- I made some major and difficult theological shifts).

I think that a discussion of Gothard's concepts of _Scripture_meditation_ would
be very appropriate for this list. I don't have my notebooks handy, but from
memory, he leads students through not only taking the words into the mind
through study and memorization, but also through the emotions through
visualizing the truths at hand in "real" situations, and through the spirit by
singing the Word back to the Lord in worship. In these applications I BELIEVE
that using the term "visualizing" is NOT "New Age" stuff, but employing a
powerful technique PROPERLY.

"Roger E. Doriot" wrote:
> 
> I, too, really appreciated what was given at the Basic Institute in
> Life Principles (Bill Gothard) on Scripture memorization and
> meditation. (Actually, I've told many people that I think that one
> week seminar is worth a year in Bible college!) We attended several
> times and found many very Biblical principles presented very
> practically - in addition to this area. Having been working in
> Indonesia for some years, we haven't had a chance to attend one of
> those seminars recently, so I'd also be
interested
> in hearing what some others have found recently at these, especially
> in this area of memorization and meditation. > > Yours in Christ,>
> Roger Doriot > UFM International

I remember talking with a surgeon who was teaching science in a private
Christian school in central Louisiana, who was having his _science_ classes
memorize good-sized blocks of Scripture. His family was participating in the
ATIA homeschooling curriculum, an outgrowth of Gothard's IBLP ministries. These
kids were doing well, and actually learning SCIENCE, in a Word-centered and
Christ-centered context.

I'm not sure how much "new" stuff about Scripture memory and meditation would be
showing up in the Basic Seminar. But I'm VERY interested in hearing more reports
about the ATIA kids. Since I haven't been involved in this myself, I have a hard
time figuring out how this would be done, but here's the "party line": Instead
of separating their studies into separate "subjects", their approach is to START
with the Scriptures, and then study in depth related topics. By the time some of
these students were graduating from "high school", they were qualified for
pre-med, pre-law, pre-"financial services" & accountancy... To hear the way
folks were effusing about the program, you either had to suspect that they were
exaggerating or that this was the best thing since sliced bread. The biggest
problem reported with these students was that they tended to be "cocky". (If I
knew, and knew that I knew, more than 99.99% of the people around me, and that I
knew what to DO with my knowledge, I think I might be in danger of being cocky
too.)


> PS. If any of you are looking for things to pray for, pray for my
students
> as I put a lot of emphasis on Scripture memorization in my classes
> here
at
> Washington Bible College near DC, where I'm teaching a few hours
> during furlough. Some of them think it is kind of heavy! :)

I think it's a "no-brainer" that students in a seminary or Bible college should
be required to memorize key passages of Scripture. In my seminary studies at
ASBS (AUBS), the Bible itself was the primary textbook in every class, even in
topical classes that weren't particularly "Bible" classes. Not many instructors
stressed MEMORIZATION, although some included Scripture memory assignments as
part of their courses. But
--Hey!-- if you're a graduate of a _Bible_ college, shouldn't you come away with
LOTS of BIBLE?

The things I've been thinking about lately concerning Scripture memorization and
meditation have been revolving around "nuts & bolts" -type stuff... probably
because of my own PROBLEMS in actually spending the TIME needed working on
_memorizing_ the words. Until my last "regular" job was terminated about a year
and a half ago, I had had a pretty good track record about at-the-desk STUDY
time and also walking-around "night watch" reflection time. (I was a resident
staff security guard for a Baptist- run senior apartment community for 7 years,
and for several years before that was a more-than-full-time family caregiver.)
Oddly, since my day-to-day scheduling has become VERY flexible, I've had a very
hard time being CONSISTENT with direct Bible intake. I might spend most of the
day for 3 or 4 days in a row preparing initials study sheets, or copying out
texts of individual verses for topical memory, and then not return to _that_ for
several days. I really NEED to figure out how to reserve early time for Bible
study and prayer, but was awakened this morning by a neighbor- emergency, and
returned home to go straight to the computer.  ...I'll resist other tempting
tangents here. ...  Before somebody shoots back at me, I realize that one thing
I need to do is to get to bed earlier. (After seven years of getting to bed at
2am, 11pm still seems early... I NEED to get to bed earlier so I can get up
earlier.)

I've noticed some discussions of audio intake of Scripture, with emphasis on the
Scripture being memorized, employing mini-cassette recorders and minidisc
recorders. Several months ago I purchased the NASB NT on cassette and listened
to that in my car until my in-dash cassette player apparently died. I have
listened a little on my Walkman, but not consistently. I'm attracted to the
varieties of laserdisks (CD-R & minidisk) because they're less fragile than
magnetic tape. I've had LOTS of cassettes chewed up by EVIL cassette decks.
(NEVER buy GPX
_anything_!) I've comforted myself concerning the loss of paper study-notes
(especially initials sheets) that even just the creation of them was a blessed
interaction with God's Word, and doing them over would be another blessing
rather than being an unwelcome chore. I suppose that I could feel that way about
self-made minicassette recordings. But one of the things that Parakletos
Ministries and Christian Digital Library Foundation have purposed to do is to
produce media resources for growing disciples, and I'm looking around for other
ways to encourage both topical and block memorization of the Scriptures.

While typing this message, I had an IM chat with a minister in India. I asked
him how he encouraged his workers to memorize Scripture and he told me that they
worked on memorizing, thinking about, and talking together about a verse every
day. I file- shared with him the one-year courses based on R.A.Torrey and Louis
Berkhof available from the  website...

BTW, in hand-copying out the Berkhof course (SCDMem), I found entirely too many
typographical errors in the Scripture references. I hope to have posted a
corrected version SOON.

Okay, Roger, I'll pray for you and your students. I'll ask you to pray for
Parakletos Ministries and the Christian Digital Library Foundation, as we seek
to produce things and DO things that will encourage local churches and
individual disciples to grow, and to minister to others. We're in the
slightly-awkward "beginning" stages of getting the ministry set up as a
functioning "real world" organization, and we're having a team meeting tonight.

God bless you richly!

--Clyde


--
Clyde C. PRICE, Jr.   h-678-393-1782, m-678-491-0469
reply to: 
Founder & President, the Christian Digital Library Foundation 
To learn more write . CDLF is looking for Scribes, Eager
Readers, and other friends to enjoy, distribute, and produce digital Christian
books and other resources to build up the Body of Christ. Vice President,
Parakletos Ministries Inc. PM seeks to support the ministries of local churches
in building evangelizing Kingdom-seeking disciples. Box 214, Suite 205 11770
Haynes Bridge Rd. Alpharetta, GA 30004 USA

Can you be more specific?  How did this fellow apply the "shema"?

Brian Janko
brianjankonet.com




----- Original Message -----
From: "Bob and Sharree Phillips" 
To: 
Sent: Tuesday, April 16, 2002 3:14 PM
Subject: Re: New and some thoughts


> Hi all,
>
> My name is Bob Phillips. This note is in reference to scripture
> memorization. I had a conversation with one of our members who, for
> example, had memorized the entire book of Mark, and got up one evening
> at service and recited one of the chapters.
>
> I then asked him after the service how he had done this.  He said that
> he had done this based on the concept of the Shema (Deut. 6:4-9):
>
> 4 Hear, O Israel: The LORD our God is one LORD: 5 And thou shalt love
> the LORD thy God with all thine heart, and with all thy soul, and with
> all thy might. 6 And these words, which I command thee this day, shall
> be in thine heart: 7 And thou shalt teach them diligently unto thy
> children, and shalt talk of them when thou sittest in thine house, and
> when thou walkest by the way, and when thou liest down, and when thou
> risest up. 8 And thou shalt bind them for a sign upon thine hand, and
> they shall be as frontlets between thine eyes. 9 And thou shalt write
> them upon the posts of thy house, and on thy gates.
>
> It seemed to work pretty well for him.
>
> Blessings all,
>
> Bob
>
>
>
>
>
>