Sent: Tuesday, April 02, 2002 4:24 PM Subject: RE: Scripture Memorization From: Michael Beavers Hi everyone, This is my first post to the Bible Memory list. I'm a licensed marriage and family therapist (in California) who's been leading small groups within the Christian community for several years. I've been memorizing passages of Scripture (with varying degrees of commitment) for over twenty years. My history with memorization/meditation goes back to Bill Gothard and his section of the red notebook (Basic Youth Conflicts) that highlights the importance of Scripture memorization/meditation and makes the promise of great success to anyone who will memorize/meditate (his recommendation is about 20 verses/week--give me a break, I've never been in that stratosphere for long, though I am sure he's right about the blessing). Here is one of my strategies which has been a huge help for me. It is designed to work with passages of five or more verses but can be used, I suppose, for verse memory. Anyway, the method is to record the first letter of each word on index cards which allows for review and word perfect memory. It also is a great motivational aide (sure beats just repeating the text over and over!). Just because I can, I usually also have a card with the text completely spelled out. The cards end up looking like this: **************************** 1 Cor. 5:1-10 IiarttisiayaoaktdnoeapAmhhfw2AyapSyrhbfwgahpooyftmwdt3EtIanppIawyisAIhap jotowdtjaiIwp4WyaaitnooLJaIawyisatpooLJip5htmotSsttsnmbdahssotdotL 6 YbingDyktalywttwbod 7 Grotoytymbanbwyayra FCoPlhbs8TluktFnwtoytyomawbwbwytbosat 9Ihwyimlntawsip 10 naamtpotwwaiotgasoiItcywhtltw 1 Cor. 5:1-10 It is actually reported that there is sexual immorality among you, and of a kind that does not occur even among pagans: A man has his father's wife. [2] And you are proud! Shouldn't you rather have been filled with grief and have put out of your fellowship the man who did this? [3] Even though I am not physically present, I am with you in spirit. And I have already passed judgment on the one who did this, just as if I were present. [4] When you are assembled in the name of our Lord Jesus and I am with you in spirit, and the power of our Lord Jesus is present, [5] hand this man over to Satan, so that the sinful nature may be destroyed and his spirit saved on the day of the Lord. [6] Your boasting is not good. Don't you know that a little yeast works through the whole batch of dough? [7] Get rid of the old yeast that you may be a new batch without yeast--as you really are. For Christ, our Passover lamb, has been sacrificed. [8] Therefore let us keep the Festival, not with the old yeast, the yeast of malice and wickedness, but with bread without yeast, the bread of sincerity and truth. [9] I have written you in my letter not to associate with sexually immoral people-- [10] not at all meaning the people of this world who are immoral, or the greedy and swindlers, or idolaters. In that case you would have to leave this world. ***************************** I used to create these cards with a typewriter but, of course, now I cut and paste the text from WordSearch and use a macro in MS Word to "minimize" them. I actually bought a printer with the specific requirement in mind that it could print on 4x6 cards. This is a simple strategy that should complement other techniques for enhancing memorization and meditation. One more thing (if you're still with me)--I am currently in the midst of reading "Daws", a biography of Dawson Trotman which constantly hammers away at the importance of memorization. I heartily recommend it. Anyway, I hope this is helpful . . . God bless. Michael Beavers, MS LMFT Consultant--Children's System of Care/Wraparound =============================================================================== Sent: Tuesday, April 02, 2002 4:21 PM Subject: Re: Scripture Memorization From: Noel I have been having much difficulty memorizing scriptures. In the past, it was easy for me to memorize a chapter a week sometimes even in a few days, but lately, I can't even get one verse to stick for any length of time. What's wrong with me? N. Wright Psalm 62:11,12 __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Greetings - send holiday greetings for Easter, Passover http://greetings.yahoo.com/ =============================================================================== Sent: Wednesday, April 03, 2002 9:59 PM Subject: Re: Scripture Memorization From: Noel Michael Beavers thanks for sharing your tips about what helps you in memorizing verses. I have taken a stash of cards and have written them down just like you said first letter of every word. This is the greatest technique I've ever used. It is so helpful. Thanks again noel __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - online filing with TurboTax http://taxes.yahoo.com/ =============================================================================== Sent: Wednesday, April 03, 2002 9:59 PM Subject: InVerse freeware: major update available From: Lynn Allan Earlier in the year, I invited people on this list to download InVerse = ver. 3.0.xx. Since that time, I have incorporated numerous enhancements = (thanks for the feedback!) and have released InVerse ver 3.2.05. This = can be considered a major upgrade to the previous version, and is = available for no cost at www.bibleinverse.org or = http://groups.yahoo.com/group/InVerse/files Enhancements include: - Comes preloaded with 326 passages with extensive context (2200+ = verses) - Context sensitive HtmlHelp built into application - Passage topic and translation shown (NASB, NIV, NKJV, KJV, etc.) - AddPassage and EditPassage imminent! (anticipated for next release = later this month) For His glory and honor, Lynn Allan =============================================================================== Sent: Wednesday, April 03, 2002 9:59 PM Subject: RE: Scripture Memorization From: Mike Montgomery Noel, probably lack of clarity in your mind. we all have this problem from time to time. sometimes i just go back and review verses i have memorized in the past... new verses can wait till i get more clarity -----Original Message----- From: Noel [mailto:psalm64_10yahoo.com] Sent: Tuesday, April 02, 2002 3:21 PM To: biblememmemoryverses.org Subject: Re: Scripture Memorization I have been having much difficulty memorizing scriptures. In the past, it was easy for me to memorize a chapter a week sometimes even in a few days, but lately, I can't even get one verse to stick for any length of time. What's wrong with me? N. Wright Psalm 62:11,12 __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Greetings - send holiday greetings for Easter, Passover http://greetings.yahoo.com/ =============================================================================== Sent: Wednesday, April 03, 2002 9:59 PM Subject: RE: Scripture Memorization From: Frank Ruth Brian- There is an important part of the equation missing from your message: why do you want to memorize scripture? If it is to keep the Word in your heart, or to fight off the devil with "the sword of the Spirit which is the Word of God", then it doesn't matter that all the verses come from the same translation. If you plan to enter a contest, use whatever version they require by the rules of the contest. If you want to reach out to others, use the translation that you feel will bear fruit in the hearts of the lost. And finally, would it be so awful that you should end up memorizing the same verse in more than one translation? In Him, Frank -----Original Message----- From: Brian Janko To: biblememmemoryverses.org Sent: 4/3/02 12:09 AM Subject: Re: Scripture Memorization Dear List, I have a very difficult issue. I have so much trouble deciding on which version to meomrize. Realizing that this could be a venture of many years, I of course want a translataion with staying power. I have formerly reae extensively from NIV. I have heard the ESV is excellent and more literal, but readable.... but who knows whether it has "staying power." Of course, the most "proven" in terms of longevitiy is the hard-to-read, but quite beautiful KJV. I guess I'm in the middle of a translation change. I was i fine while I was only reading, just sticking with the NIV. (There's the debate now about who owns that company and how long the NIV will be along and the TNIV, gender-inclusiveness somethign I would like to avoid.) When I became interested in more serious study and memorization I wanted something more literal. The NASB seems to be the winner here, but I stlll have translational problem with here and there and realize that it's literalness does not always provide accuracy of thought. So, it's I mostly waver between the NASB, the KJV, and possibly the ESV. Anyone have thought suggestions, advice guidelines help or antyghing else along those lines? Sincerely in Christ, Brian Janko brianjankonet.com =============================================================================== Sent: Wednesday, April 03, 2002 1:10 AM Subject: Re: Scripture Memorization From: LeeTidler I've been on this list for quite a while, but seldom write. I am one of the slowest memorizers there is, but I have decided to memorize all the book of Revelation, and am now on Chapter 5. What I am using is a program I purchased from Laridian called Memorize! which I put on my Palm Pilot. That in addition to the 2 versions of the Bible that I also put on it have helped me tremendously! I wish I could do better memorizing, but having done that much in less than a year is good for me. I just thank God I can read and remember. :) =============================================================================== Sent: Wednesday, April 03, 2002 1:10 AM Subject: Re: Scripture Memorization From: Once in school one of the classmates complained that they could not memorize data. When they were asked about current events they knew everything that was happening. So memorization is basically familiarization. Take a sentence (not a whole verse) or a line and try remembering it. Choose a line a day. After 5 days you will have a verse "memorized." It could be that your time is not your own. By that I mean that perhaps family members encroach on your time (children, wife, husband, mother in law, etc.) and you are trying to memorize in brief snatches. Try to take more time in solitude, reading over and over (repeatedly) the verse you want to memorize. Use a tape recorder if you need to listen to yourself to see where you falter. Try doing this the Muslim way (they pray 5 times a day) by doing it often throughout the day. It gets harder as more responsibilities encroach and as we get older it becomes more difficult. Another reason may be that you have lost your reason to memorize. Why do you memorize? And how does memorization help you? Once you establish your priority it may be easier. Also, how is your nutrition? Do you eat balanced meals and take vitamins? The body responds to good nutrition (and that includes our brains). Hope this helps. Jack Wahlberg =============================================================================== Sent: Wednesday, April 03, 2002 1:10 AM Subject: Re: Scripture Memorization From: Brian Janko Dear List, I have a very difficult issue. I have so much trouble deciding on which version to meomrize. Realizing that this could be a venture of many years, I of course want a translataion with staying power. I have formerly reae extensively from NIV. I have heard the ESV is excellent and more literal, but readable.... but who knows whether it has "staying power." Of course, the most "proven" in terms of longevitiy is the hard-to-read, but quite beautiful KJV. I guess I'm in the middle of a translation change. I was i fine while I was only reading, just sticking with the NIV. (There's the debate now about who owns that company and how long the NIV will be along and the TNIV, gender-inclusiveness somethign I would like to avoid.) When I became interested in more serious study and memorization I wanted something more literal. The NASB seems to be the winner here, but I stlll have translational problem with here and there and realize that it's literalness does not always provide accuracy of thought. So, it's I mostly waver between the NASB, the KJV, and possibly the ESV. Anyone have thought suggestions, advice guidelines help or antyghing else along those lines? Sincerely in Christ, Brian Janko brianjankonet.com =============================================================================== Sent: Sunday, April 07, 2002 12:16 AM Subject: RE: Scripture Memorization From: Wanda Hammond Thanks, for the technique of writing the first letter of each word on a card. I must admit I didn't think it would work but it great. Wanda -----Original Message----- From: LeeTidler [mailto:LeeTidlermsn.com] Sent: Tuesday, April 02, 2002 10:10 PM To: biblememmemoryverses.org Subject: Re: Scripture Memorization I've been on this list for quite a while, but seldom write. I am one of the slowest memorizers there is, but I have decided to memorize all the book of Revelation, and am now on Chapter 5. What I am using is a program I purchased from Laridian called Memorize! which I put on my Palm Pilot. That in addition to the 2 versions of the Bible that I also put on it have helped me tremendously! I wish I could do better memorizing, but having done that much in less than a year is good for me. I just thank God I can read and remember. :) =============================================================================== Sent: Sunday, April 07, 2002 12:16 AM Subject: Re: Scripture Memorization From: Michael Beavers You're most welcome. It's just a tool, but it's a nice one. In college I remember we used to laminate them so them were more durable (some would use them in the shower!) but now I do them on computer so they're practically disposable. MB _________________________________________________________________ Join the world’s largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail. http://www.hotmail.com >From: Noel >Reply-To: biblememmemoryverses.org >To: biblememmemoryverses.org >Subject: Re: Scripture Memorization >Date: Wed, 03 Apr 2002 21:59:08 -0500 > >Michael Beavers > >thanks for sharing your tips about >what helps you in memorizing verses. I have taken a >stash of cards and have written them down just like >you said first letter of every word. This is the >greatest technique I've ever used. It is so helpful. > >Thanks again > >noel > > >__________________________________________________ >Do You Yahoo!? >Yahoo! Tax Center - online filing with TurboTax http://taxes.yahoo.com/ > > > > > =============================================================================== Sent: Tuesday, April 09, 2002 11:17 PM Subject: Re: Scripture Memorization From: Linda Delbridge To: Brian Janko Greetings, I really like memorizing the NASB. After several years, I am now trying to "update" to the NASB 1995 Update and it is very difficult. Even though I think the NASB is the most accurate, I would suggest you stick with the version you have memorized the most. It is very difficult to change. In Christ Lee Delbridge LDelbridgemsn.com ----- Original Message ----- From: Brian Janko Sent: Wednesday, April 03, 2002 2:07 AM To: biblememmemoryverses.org Subject: Re: Scripture Memorization Dear List, I have a very difficult issue. I have so much trouble deciding on which version to meomrize. Realizing that this could be a venture of many years, I of course want a translataion with staying power. I have formerly reae extensively from NIV. I have heard the ESV is excellent and more literal, but readable.... but who knows whether it has "staying power." Of course, the most "proven" in terms of longevitiy is the hard-to-read, but quite beautiful KJV. I guess I'm in the middle of a translation change. I was i fine while I was only reading, just sticking with the NIV. (There's the debate now about who owns that company and how long the NIV will be along and the TNIV, gender-inclusiveness somethign I would like to avoid.) When I became interested in more serious study and memorization I wanted something more literal. The NASB seems to be the winner here, but I stll= l have translational problem with here and there and realize that it's literalness does not always provide accuracy of thought. So, it's I mostly waver between the NASB, the KJV, and possibly the ESV. Anyone have thought suggestions, advice guidelines help or antyghing else along those lines? Sincerely in Christ, Brian Janko brianjankonet.com =============================================================================== Sent: Saturday, April 13, 2002 12:35 PM Subject: New and some thoughts From: Ruth Hello! My name is Ruth and I am a wife and mother of 4 (5 yrs-5 months). I know memorization of the Bible is very important and the version of the Bible I read, memorize is the KJV. Recently I have been reading "The Memory Book" and haven't finished it yet. It has some great memory systems in it. I am now wondering, how one could use them to memorize scripture. The phoentic alphabet will help with chapter and verse location...but can you use these systems for the actual verses, chapters, book memorization. Any thoughts would be great! Ruth Ruthie_2webtv.net =============================================================================== Sent: Monday, April 15, 2002 6:59 PM Subject: Re: New and some thoughts From: Clyde PRICE Ruth, I've given some thoughts to using mnemonics for Scripture memory. Beyond using the phonetic number alphabet for numbers, memorizing the actual text of the Scriptures becomes complicated. Jerry Lucas wrote another book, (c) 1978, _Ready, Set, Remember_ from Memory Press, primarily for children, to help form chains of (funny) pictures to memorize a wide variety of information... And I'm glad I looked into the book, because I THOUGHT this was the one about Scripture memory and it's not. ... Sorry, I don't even have the title of the book I was thinking about that suggested images for linking together Bible outlines... After buying it and looking through it, I decided that I would have had difficulty using that method myself. Most mnemonic systems (e.g., _The Memory Book_) encourage students to memorize a standard mental chain, most often actually NUMBERS (typically 1-100), and encourage practice in linking items in memory with the images associated with the numbers. Harry Lorrayne later published a tape-series that was supposed to be different, but he still encouraged students to construct mental chains (assigned by him) or structures, such as the physical layout of one's home in childhood, in which to "put" things and/or "link" things to be remembered. Unfortunately, I was never able to forge the images and associations quickly enough to be useful in the "field", and I never succeeded in employing this effectively for remembering Scripture. Actually, I was first exposed to the concepts of mnemonics in my late teens, soon after I had trusted Christ, and my initial fascination with Bruno Furst's concepts in _Ready, Set, Remember_ verged over into an attitude that I decided was not spiritually healthy FOR ME. But I also went through similar "infatuation" phases with computers & telecommunications (in BBS days) and with Esperanto, the International Language. I think that all these things can be good TOOLS, and we humans tend to become infatuated with our tools. Once they're in the right place in our heart, I believe that they can be used PROPERLY in service for the Kingdom. I have no objection to employing pre-existing "chains" of association on which to link topics... or simply employing verse-numbers linking to keywords or main concepts in a verse. I just haven't done this well. I think that if a child could learn these basic concepts of mnemonics (especially the number images 1-100) very early on... like maybe while in the process of learning the numbers themselves, that using association-links would seem much less artificial. I've heard hints that SOME homeschoolers employ mnemonics for general studies, but haven't heard much about using this with Scripture memory. Frankly, I've never succeeded in using "funny pictures" to string together the themes of Scripture. I have made a practice of skim-reading, or really, page-flipping, through my marked-up study Bible, counting through the chapters and trying to catalog/review the topics of the paragraphs/ sections in each chapter. I'm sure that the Irving Jensen style Inductive Bible study procedures (generally also used by InterVarsity Christian Fellowship) which have students prepare paragraph charts for the book being studied, would work even better for theme review. The "initials" technique with a coach would be good for getting the word-for-word contents tightened up. It sounds funny to say it this way, but I think people (at least myself!) need to be reminded that memorizing the WORDS of Scripture is not quite the same thing as STUDYING the Scriptures, understanding their contents, and applying them to our lives. Henrietta Mears in _What the Bible is All About_ employs lots of "cute" things to help illustrate and string together the ideas and contents of the texts being considered, and --although it doesn't LOOK "scholarly", WTBIAA actually serves as a pretty good Bible survey textbook. The more you study the Bible in context, and THINK about the "flow" of thought and action in the text, the better you'll be able to remember it. Concerning Jerry Lucas' techniques of associating funny pictures with the outline-contents of Scripture, I heard some folks object to using "funny" stuff to help remember God's holy Word (and I admit that I had some of those thoughts myself). However, I'm not so sure that this is any worse than what other folks have done with Holy Writ... And I think it's much more a matter of the heart of the individual Bible student. I don't think that there's any "magic" technique for memorizing Scripture. It helps a LOT if you started memorizing literature (including Scripture) in childhood. I'm glad that my parents put me into a program in which I was required to memorize and recite poetry, and later encouraged me in drama/acting, in which I had to memorize my scripts QUICKLY. Lots of Muslims scattered all around the world, beginning in childhood, memorize the entire Koran _in_Arabic_, which is close in length to the New Testament. However, typically, they are taught to emphasize memorizing the WORDS correctly, and we would want to emphasize understanding the MEANING and APPLICATIONS of the Scripture, as well as the words themselves. We also have the major difference that Protestant Christians usually use translations rather than encouraging EVERYBODY to learn Hebrew and Greek, and NO _translation_ can truly claim to be inspired by God. Over 20 years ago, when I was in college & beginning seminary, I heard the report that one young man in our college department had memorized the entire New American Standard Bible New Testament, but he didn't want his identity to be known. My "prime suspect" evaded some of my direct questions, married a sweet young lady, and took a job as an engineer. One does NOT have to BE a preacher or BECOME a preacher to memorize and meditate on the Scriptures. The promises in Psalm 1, Joshua 1 and James 1 are that those who MEDITATE on Scripture will be successful in whatever they do... and there are lots of things to do in the "real world" that do NOT involve "becoming a 'minister'"... ...Sorry,... I slipped over onto my soap-box... Let us know whatever more you find out about mnemonics, and how you're able to employ it in Scripture memorization. I'm still thinking about this stuff, and am still committed to being a "lifetime learner", even now that I'm officially "pushing 50"... (I'll turn 49 in June). It has been several years since I've reviewed the _Institute in Basic Life Principles_ (formerly, "Institute in Basic Youth Conflicts"), taught by Bill Gothard. I thought that his suggestions and guidelines for memorizing and meditating on Scripture were very valuable. Can anybody on the list post some more recent reports about Gothard's ministry? God bless! --Clyde Ruth wrote: > > Hello! My name is Ruth and I am a wife and mother of 4 (5 yrs-5 > months). I know memorization of the Bible is very important and the > version of the Bible I read, memorize is the KJV. > > Recently I have been reading "The Memory Book" and haven't finished it > yet. It has some great memory systems in it. > > I am now wondering, how one could use them to memorize scripture. The > phoentic alphabet will help with chapter and verse location...but can > you use these systems for the actual verses, chapters, book > memorization. > > Any thoughts would be great! > > Ruth > > Ruthie_2webtv.net -- Clyde C. PRICE, Jr. h-678-393-1782, m-678-491-0469 reply to: Founder & President, the Christian Digital Library Foundation To learn more write . CDLF is looking for Scribes, Eager Readers, and other friends to enjoy, distribute, and produce digital Christian books and other resources to build up the Body of Christ. Vice President, Parakletos Ministries Inc. PM seeks to support the ministries of local churches in building evangelizing Kingdom-seeking disciples. Box 214, Suite 205 11770 Haynes Bridge Rd. Alpharetta, GA 30004 USA =============================================================================== Sent: Tuesday, April 16, 2002 6:14 PM Subject: Memorization and meditation From: Roger E. Doriot >I've given some thoughts to using mnemonics for Scripture memory ... Clyde, appreciate your sharing all those thoughts! I, too, really appreciated what was given at the Basic Institute in Life Principles (Bill Gothard) on Scripture memorization and meditation. (Actually, I've told many people that I think that one week seminar is worth a year in Bible college!) We attended several times and found many very Biblical principles presented very practically - in addition to this area. Having been working in Indonesia for some years, we haven't had a chance to attend one of those seminars recently, so I'd also be interested in hearing what some others have found recently at these, especially in this area of memorization and meditation. Yours in Christ, Roger Doriot UFM International PS. If any of you are looking for things to pray for, pray for my students as I put a lot of emphasis on Scripture memorization in my classes here at Washington Bible College near DC, where I'm teaching a few hours during furlough. Some of them think it is kind of heavy! :) =============================================================================== Sent: Tuesday, April 16, 2002 6:14 PM Subject: Re: New and some thoughts From: Bob and Sharree Phillips Hi all, My name is Bob Phillips. This note is in reference to scripture memorization. I had a conversation with one of our members who, for example, had memorized the entire book of Mark, and got up one evening at service and recited one of the chapters. I then asked him after the service how he had done this. He said that he had done this based on the concept of the Shema (Deut. 6:4-9): 4 Hear, O Israel: The LORD our God is one LORD: 5 And thou shalt love the LORD thy God with all thine heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy might. 6 And these words, which I command thee this day, shall be in thine heart: 7 And thou shalt teach them diligently unto thy children, and shalt talk of them when thou sittest in thine house, and when thou walkest by the way, and when thou liest down, and when thou risest up. 8 And thou shalt bind them for a sign upon thine hand, and they shall be as frontlets between thine eyes. 9 And thou shalt write them upon the posts of thy house, and on thy gates. It seemed to work pretty well for him. Blessings all, Bob =============================================================================== Sent: Tuesday, April 16, 2002 6:14 PM Subject: Re: New and some thoughts From: Brian Janko Ruth, If you're interested, I found this book by Jerry Lucas listed on Amazon.com. However, it seems to be more oriented to memorizing Bible facts -- the 12 apostles, the parables, the Books of the Bible, the Ten Commandments, the Fruit of the Spirit, Gifts of the Spirit, etc. -- rather than actual verses. However, I did not look it over very thoroughly so I could be wrong about that. http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/1930853068/qid=1018913749/sr=1-5/ref = sr_1_5/102-2548696-0676168 Brian Janko brianjankonet.com =============================================================================== Sent: Monday, April 22, 2002 6:09 PM Subject: Re: Scripture Memorization From: Clyde PRICE To Linda and Brian, Choosing an English translation is NOT an easy task, and in the current "market" in which the translations we've BEEN using and the very new ones that we would CONSIDER using are all likely to go through significant edition-changes before long. I agree with Linda that "upgrading" from NASB77 to NASB95 is a hassle, but I had gotten rusty on my bulk-memory anyway, so "upgrading" may not be much more work than simply _reviewing_ would have been, for me. I really NEED a "coach". To Brian: After spending only minutes in ESV, I considered that the passages I looked at quickly were at least as awkward as the general style in NASB. The older RSV is still being published by a very few publishers. I haven't yet had the opportunity to review the new TNIV, and have heard mixed reports about this version: The negative statements I've seen seem to be rooted in objections to the policy itself of making general statements gender-neutral (as was the stated policy of NRSV). Of course, objections to this policy have to be evaluated on a case-by-case basis, and I have already found in NRSV places which were "neutralized" which should not have been, and I often didn't like the way they handled it even in cases which I did consider legitimate. I've enjoyed reading in the LBT, but haven't read enough to give a real "review". I'm not really satisfied with any of the older English versions with which I'm familiar, mostly because of idiosyncrasies of one-person versions and/or archaic language. >From a very personal standpoint, I don't like about half the changes from NASB77 to NASB95. Neither edition is "perfect", but then NO English translation (or any other translation) is PERFECT. For MY OWN memorization, I've decided to stay with NASB95, but I don't recommend this strongly to others. I WISH that I had a better recommendation. I'm watching this discussion, and the issue in general, with great interest. --Clyde Linda Delbridge wrote: > > To: Brian Janko > > Greetings, > > I really like memorizing the NASB. After several years, I am now > trying to "update" to the NASB 1995 Update and it is very difficult. > > Even though I think the NASB is the most accurate, I would suggest you > stick with the version you have memorized the most. It is very > difficult to change. > > In Christ > > Lee Delbridge > LDelbridgemsn.com > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: Brian Janko > Sent: Wednesday, April 03, 2002 2:07 AM > To: biblememmemoryverses.org > Subject: Re: Scripture Memorization > > Dear List, > > I have a very difficult issue. I have so much trouble deciding on > which version to meomrize. Realizing that this could be a venture of > many years, > I of course want a translataion with staying power. > > I have formerly reae extensively from NIV. I have heard the ESV is > excellent and more literal, but readable.... but who knows whether it > has "staying power." > > Of course, the most "proven" in terms of longevitiy is the > hard-to-read, but quite beautiful KJV. > > I guess I'm in the middle of a translation change. I was i fine while > I was only reading, just sticking with the NIV. (There's the debate > now about who owns that company and how long the NIV will be along and > the TNIV, gender-inclusiveness somethign I would like to avoid.) > > When I became interested in more serious study and memorization I > wanted something more literal. The NASB seems to be the winner here, > but I stll= > l have translational problem with here and there and realize that it's > literalness does not always provide accuracy of thought. > > So, it's I mostly waver between the NASB, the KJV, and possibly the > ESV. > > Anyone have thought suggestions, advice guidelines help or antyghing > else along those lines? > > Sincerely in Christ, > Brian Janko > brianjankonet.com -- Clyde C. PRICE, Jr. h-678-393-1782, m-678-491-0469 reply to: Founder & President, the Christian Digital Library Foundation To learn more write . CDLF is looking for Scribes, Eager Readers, and other friends to enjoy, distribute, and produce digital Christian books and other resources to build up the Body of Christ. Vice President, Parakletos Ministries Inc. PM seeks to support the ministries of local churches in building evangelizing Kingdom-seeking disciples. Box 214, Suite 205 11770 Haynes Bridge Rd. Alpharetta, GA 30004 USA =============================================================================== Sent: Monday, April 22, 2002 6:09 PM Subject: Re: New and some thoughts From: Dr.H.Troendle > Recently I have been reading "The Memory Book" and haven't finished it > yet. It has some great memory systems in it. Hi Ruth, could you tell me more about "The Memory Book" ? I have been searching for mnemo/memory-techniques lately for memorizing bible-verses. But I had not very much response from people using mnemo-techniques in bible memorizing. So I would be very interested In HIS grace <>< dino Hi Clyde, your mail caught my interest. I want to answer to it "verse-topic by verse" > I've given some thoughts to using mnemonics for Scripture memory. Me too > Beyond using the phonetic number alphabet for numbers, what does that mean? I am German and therefore am forced to ask for more understanding, sometimes. > Jerry Lucas wrote another book, (c) 1978 would you advise this book? > Most mnemonic systems (e.g., _The Memory Book_) encourage students to > memorize a standard mental chain, most often actually NUMBERS > (typically 1-100), and encourage practice in linking items in memory > with the images associated with the numbers. Could you give me an outline where to get info's about these mnemonic systems? > Harry Lorrayne later published a tape-series that was supposed to be > different, where would it be available? >Unfortunately, I was never able to forge the images and associations >quickly enough to be useful in the "field", and I never succeeded in >employing this effectively for remembering Scripture. I used once a chain of body-feelings like folding hands or forming a cup and thus remembering. In the beginning I did these things really, afterwards, to recall for memorizing, I had only to think of these movements to recall the verses. > Actually, I was first exposed to the concepts of mnemonics in my late > teens, soon after I had trusted Christ, and my initial fascination > with Bruno Furst's concepts in _Ready, Set, Remember_ verged over into > an attitude that I decided was not spiritually healthy FOR ME. where could I get Bruno Furst's? When I searched the net for mnemo-tech's and books, i sometime got the feeling that the purpose of some authors was esoteric influenced. therefore I wanted to wait till I could share with believers. On the other hand. In the days before book-printing memorizing was mandatory for students and for speakers to memorize all they wanted to learn or talk about or when holding a speech. I wanted to trace these old techniques which have been used for instance in Greek and Roman days. > Frankly, I've never succeeded in using "funny pictures" to string > together the themes of Scripture. Every-one uses one sense more often, like right-handed ones use mostly the right hands. As kid I used to train my left hand to do what usually I did with my right hand. As the right hand is steered to 70% by the left part of the brain, I thought trainig my left hand would train myself to be able to use better my right brain-hemisphere. > have made a practice of > skim-reading, or really, page-flipping, what does that mean? >'m sure that the Irving Jensen style Inductive Bible study procedures (generally also > used by InterVarsity Christian Fellowship) How does that work and where can I get info about it? > that memorizing the WORDS of Scripture is not quite the same thing as > STUDYING the Scriptures, understanding their contents, and applying > them to our lives. Right , but it goes hand in hand > Henrietta Mears in _What the Bible is All About_ employs lots of > "cute" things to help illustrate and string together the ideas and > contents of the texts being considered, and --although it doesn't LOOK > "scholarly", WTBIAA actually serves as a pretty good Bible survey > textbook. where can I get more info about it? The more > you study the Bible in context, and THINK about the "flow" of thought > and action in the text, the better you'll be able to remember it. exactly > typically, they are > taught to emphasize memorizing the WORDS correctly, and we would want > to emphasize understanding the MEANING and APPLICATIONS of the > Scripture, as well as the words themselves. We also have the major > difference that Protestant Christians usually use translations rather > than encouraging EVERYBODY to learn Hebrew and Greek, and NO > _translation_ can truly claim to be inspired by God. Here in Germany when you want to become a muslim you should learn the coran by heart,and the " pupils" have to do it, even not knowing what it means because they don't learn arabic. It is not wanted that they know what they learn. But learning Greek and Hebrew at my age? 58! I doubt that I would be able to gather the sense. for instance how could I find out what the hebrew word for rib really means? I know three meanings : 1. rib 2. side 3. cell for me it's the first adopted gene-technology, just to show us nowadays: for me,GOD the almighty, this was nothing cmpared to how long you needed only to think about it, and you are able to do it only because I created you. > It has been several years since I've reviewed the _Institute in Basic > Life Principles_ (formerly, "Institute in Basic Youth Conflicts"), > taught by Bill Gothard. I thought that his suggestions and guidelines > for memorizing and meditating on Scripture were very valuable. Can > anybody on the list post some more recent reports about Gothard's > ministry? Could you tell me where to get info about this? Thank you for listening and I thank you for bothering to provide me with info's. Yours in HIS Grace <>< Dino =============================================================================== Sent: Monday, April 22, 2002 6:09 PM Subject: Re: New and some thoughts From: Drake Mariani Good stuff Henry, Gothard's ministry is still exploding. I see a lot of it going to homeschool conventions. A significant # of them go through his training in high school and government officials are really being touched by a branch they have. Additionally, nearly 80,000 home schoolers use my mnemonic based MEMLOK Bible Memory System, for which I am eternally thankful. I just posted a new free DEMO at http://www.memlok.com/ At 4/15/02 03:58 PM, you wrote: >'ve heard hints that >SOME homeschoolers employ mnemonics for general studies, but haven't >heard much about using this with Scripture memory. Drake & Gina Mariani 800-373-1947 420 Montwood La Habra CA 90631 * MEMLOK The "Word Picture" Bible Memory System * http://www.memlok.com Email: mailto:memlokmemlok.com * FREE Scripture Memory Cards * http://www.memlok.com/free-scripture-memory-cards.html * FREE Juice Plus Kids 6-15 http://www.memlok.com/jpcass.html * Christians Pay Your Meds http://www.memlok.com/samaritan.html =============================================================================== Sent: Monday, April 22, 2002 6:09 PM Subject: Re: Memorization and meditation From: Clyde PRICE Roger, It's good to "meet" another IBLP alumnus. The impact on my life of the Basic seminar was certainly greater on my day-to-day life than any year of my seminary experience (except that in my first year at Atlanta School of Biblical Studies --now American University of Biblical Studies-- I made some major and difficult theological shifts). I think that a discussion of Gothard's concepts of _Scripture_meditation_ would be very appropriate for this list. I don't have my notebooks handy, but from memory, he leads students through not only taking the words into the mind through study and memorization, but also through the emotions through visualizing the truths at hand in "real" situations, and through the spirit by singing the Word back to the Lord in worship. In these applications I BELIEVE that using the term "visualizing" is NOT "New Age" stuff, but employing a powerful technique PROPERLY. "Roger E. Doriot" wrote: > > I, too, really appreciated what was given at the Basic Institute in > Life Principles (Bill Gothard) on Scripture memorization and > meditation. (Actually, I've told many people that I think that one > week seminar is worth a year in Bible college!) We attended several > times and found many very Biblical principles presented very > practically - in addition to this area. Having been working in > Indonesia for some years, we haven't had a chance to attend one of > those seminars recently, so I'd also be interested > in hearing what some others have found recently at these, especially > in this area of memorization and meditation. > > Yours in Christ,> > Roger Doriot > UFM International I remember talking with a surgeon who was teaching science in a private Christian school in central Louisiana, who was having his _science_ classes memorize good-sized blocks of Scripture. His family was participating in the ATIA homeschooling curriculum, an outgrowth of Gothard's IBLP ministries. These kids were doing well, and actually learning SCIENCE, in a Word-centered and Christ-centered context. I'm not sure how much "new" stuff about Scripture memory and meditation would be showing up in the Basic Seminar. But I'm VERY interested in hearing more reports about the ATIA kids. Since I haven't been involved in this myself, I have a hard time figuring out how this would be done, but here's the "party line": Instead of separating their studies into separate "subjects", their approach is to START with the Scriptures, and then study in depth related topics. By the time some of these students were graduating from "high school", they were qualified for pre-med, pre-law, pre-"financial services" & accountancy... To hear the way folks were effusing about the program, you either had to suspect that they were exaggerating or that this was the best thing since sliced bread. The biggest problem reported with these students was that they tended to be "cocky". (If I knew, and knew that I knew, more than 99.99% of the people around me, and that I knew what to DO with my knowledge, I think I might be in danger of being cocky too.) > PS. If any of you are looking for things to pray for, pray for my students > as I put a lot of emphasis on Scripture memorization in my classes > here at > Washington Bible College near DC, where I'm teaching a few hours > during furlough. Some of them think it is kind of heavy! :) I think it's a "no-brainer" that students in a seminary or Bible college should be required to memorize key passages of Scripture. In my seminary studies at ASBS (AUBS), the Bible itself was the primary textbook in every class, even in topical classes that weren't particularly "Bible" classes. Not many instructors stressed MEMORIZATION, although some included Scripture memory assignments as part of their courses. But --Hey!-- if you're a graduate of a _Bible_ college, shouldn't you come away with LOTS of BIBLE? The things I've been thinking about lately concerning Scripture memorization and meditation have been revolving around "nuts & bolts" -type stuff... probably because of my own PROBLEMS in actually spending the TIME needed working on _memorizing_ the words. Until my last "regular" job was terminated about a year and a half ago, I had had a pretty good track record about at-the-desk STUDY time and also walking-around "night watch" reflection time. (I was a resident staff security guard for a Baptist- run senior apartment community for 7 years, and for several years before that was a more-than-full-time family caregiver.) Oddly, since my day-to-day scheduling has become VERY flexible, I've had a very hard time being CONSISTENT with direct Bible intake. I might spend most of the day for 3 or 4 days in a row preparing initials study sheets, or copying out texts of individual verses for topical memory, and then not return to _that_ for several days. I really NEED to figure out how to reserve early time for Bible study and prayer, but was awakened this morning by a neighbor- emergency, and returned home to go straight to the computer. ...I'll resist other tempting tangents here. ... Before somebody shoots back at me, I realize that one thing I need to do is to get to bed earlier. (After seven years of getting to bed at 2am, 11pm still seems early... I NEED to get to bed earlier so I can get up earlier.) I've noticed some discussions of audio intake of Scripture, with emphasis on the Scripture being memorized, employing mini-cassette recorders and minidisc recorders. Several months ago I purchased the NASB NT on cassette and listened to that in my car until my in-dash cassette player apparently died. I have listened a little on my Walkman, but not consistently. I'm attracted to the varieties of laserdisks (CD-R & minidisk) because they're less fragile than magnetic tape. I've had LOTS of cassettes chewed up by EVIL cassette decks. (NEVER buy GPX _anything_!) I've comforted myself concerning the loss of paper study-notes (especially initials sheets) that even just the creation of them was a blessed interaction with God's Word, and doing them over would be another blessing rather than being an unwelcome chore. I suppose that I could feel that way about self-made minicassette recordings. But one of the things that Parakletos Ministries and Christian Digital Library Foundation have purposed to do is to produce media resources for growing disciples, and I'm looking around for other ways to encourage both topical and block memorization of the Scriptures. While typing this message, I had an IM chat with a minister in India. I asked him how he encouraged his workers to memorize Scripture and he told me that they worked on memorizing, thinking about, and talking together about a verse every day. I file- shared with him the one-year courses based on R.A.Torrey and Louis Berkhof available from the website... BTW, in hand-copying out the Berkhof course (SCDMem), I found entirely too many typographical errors in the Scripture references. I hope to have posted a corrected version SOON. Okay, Roger, I'll pray for you and your students. I'll ask you to pray for Parakletos Ministries and the Christian Digital Library Foundation, as we seek to produce things and DO things that will encourage local churches and individual disciples to grow, and to minister to others. We're in the slightly-awkward "beginning" stages of getting the ministry set up as a functioning "real world" organization, and we're having a team meeting tonight. God bless you richly! --Clyde -- Clyde C. PRICE, Jr. h-678-393-1782, m-678-491-0469 reply to: Founder & President, the Christian Digital Library Foundation To learn more write . CDLF is looking for Scribes, Eager Readers, and other friends to enjoy, distribute, and produce digital Christian books and other resources to build up the Body of Christ. Vice President, Parakletos Ministries Inc. PM seeks to support the ministries of local churches in building evangelizing Kingdom-seeking disciples. Box 214, Suite 205 11770 Haynes Bridge Rd. Alpharetta, GA 30004 USA =============================================================================== Sent: Monday, April 22, 2002 6:09 PM Subject: Re: New and some thoughts From: Brian Janko Can you be more specific? How did this fellow apply the "shema"? Brian Janko brianjankonet.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bob and Sharree Phillips" To: Sent: Tuesday, April 16, 2002 3:14 PM Subject: Re: New and some thoughts > Hi all, > > My name is Bob Phillips. This note is in reference to scripture > memorization. I had a conversation with one of our members who, for > example, had memorized the entire book of Mark, and got up one evening > at service and recited one of the chapters. > > I then asked him after the service how he had done this. He said that > he had done this based on the concept of the Shema (Deut. 6:4-9): > > 4 Hear, O Israel: The LORD our God is one LORD: 5 And thou shalt love > the LORD thy God with all thine heart, and with all thy soul, and with > all thy might. 6 And these words, which I command thee this day, shall > be in thine heart: 7 And thou shalt teach them diligently unto thy > children, and shalt talk of them when thou sittest in thine house, and > when thou walkest by the way, and when thou liest down, and when thou > risest up. 8 And thou shalt bind them for a sign upon thine hand, and > they shall be as frontlets between thine eyes. 9 And thou shalt write > them upon the posts of thy house, and on thy gates. > > It seemed to work pretty well for him. > > Blessings all, > > Bob > > > > > > ===============================================================================